How Michael Bigos Redefines Branding Beyond the Visuals

[00:00:02] Hector: Hello and welcome to another episode of the how to scale a business podcast. My name is Hector Santhia Esteban, and I am your host for today. Our special guest is Mr Michael Bigos. He is, uh, well, from the outside, he might look like branding expert or branding consultant strategist, but we're gonna talk about why it's more than that today and how it's lot deeper than that.

[00:00:21] Hector: So, Mike, thanks for hanging out with us.

[00:00:23] Michael: I have to thank you for having me, man. Appreciate the opportunity.

[00:00:26] Hector: a lot of times I have the opportunity to chat with guests, before our recordings to kind of get an idea about, their business and all those sorts of stuff. And I'm glad that we did in our instance, because a lot of people see branding or know, like, I think even I made the mistake of like, what Bucket do we put you in?

[00:00:43] Hector: You know, what umbrella do we put you in? And you actually made some really good points. So why don't you share a little bit about what you do, how it's perhaps different than what a lot of people are doing. And then if you could also sprinkle in kind of how you got there as well.

[00:00:57] Michael: sure. So I like to consider myself, you know, a branding specialist, if you will. I don't even know if that's a broader term, but what I really like to do is help my clients get visual and verbal clarity. believe oftentimes entrepreneurs, business owners are really good at what they do, but they're not often good at explaining how they do business.

[00:01:14] Michael: What they do, a very simplified So a lot of times when I'm consulting, I'm helping my clients get clarity and focus and then are helping them articulate, their offer, their business or product to their customer. So the way I do that is I do consulting, I do branding implementation as far as, you know, the design aspect of it, but I also leverage my skill set experience and Omni experience and customer experience, uh, UI, if you will, now it's become hot term topic nowadays.

[00:01:40] Michael: But yeah, definitely wrapping in it. So it's really three phase and simplistic terms. We're consulting on messaging and positioning. We're implementing branding identity assets. We're also incorporating omni channel customer experiences.

[00:01:52] Hector: It's interesting. One our clients, he runs a mastermind group and he said something that he did for his mastermind. Group members was help them to figure out exactly what you talked about. What is it that they do? it seems like that's a common problem. why is it that people can do what they do, but they don't really know how to explain or say what they do.

[00:02:10] Hector: I

[00:02:10] Michael: Yeah, it's actually a skill set I've learned over the years. And 46 years old. And, joined the military when I was, 19. about three years in, I started doing design. So it's been a little over 20 years now that I've been doing design. I've done this all over the world and I've just found that it's real simple.

[00:02:25] Michael: It's not something that's taught, we go to school, we get degrees, we, we get all this education, but when it comes to starting a business, well, starting a business aspects of that is taught, the financials, economics piece, of the marketing and the business acumen pieces is accounted for when it comes to creative services and how to engage with or how to communicate your offer. There are things out there. And a lot of them are, fragmented because it's, really subjective. It really is subjective. So we hear elevator pitches, that's been a really hot topic over the years. And I think it's just more than that. So we've kind of graduated from elevator pitches to communicating what you do to now, what we know is one liners, log lines that you see in movies, it's just not something that's, really innate in people that they attain and something that you have to learn and put to practice. in summary. I used to do a lot of graphics work for entrepreneurs, especially I was in Europe I realized I was doing a lot of great graphics for them, but I didn't know whether or not it was actually helping them business grow or not.

[00:03:20] Michael: I just did great work, at least by them. And then it got to the point where I was like, got started in doing what I'm doing partly because I've always been an artist. I've done fine art and all those things. And I just really wanted to help people. Like, I really believe like, you know, anyone that has a really great product service, they deserve to get noticed.

[00:03:33] Michael: It it deserves a recognition and, play that it should, if it's good and if it's good to use. But I didn't know graphics design in itself was helping. So that's how I ventured in. And I had, I've been doing logos and different things as well. As part of sometimes doing a graphic or flyer happened to be like doing a logo too, like over a comedy club thing and we need a logo plus a flyer.

[00:03:51] Michael: I said, okay. So I started doing brand that way, but I got to the point where I'm like, I really want to make sure that I'm helping. Yeah. These customers grow and that there's an opportunity that I can help measure their launch and their growth. So that's, really where the branding came into play.

[00:04:03] Michael: And then as I began to do this, I realized, well, how the heck do I help them now? So do good work. I'm still pretty efficient at fast. do I really help them understand and know with assurance? That not only are they going to part with their money with me, because it's not always cheap, but also that they're going to feel good about parting with that money because they're going to be assured that what we went through and what we did and where we arrived to is actually authentic for them.

[00:04:25] Michael: So as I began to put that in practice, it became more and more evident, man, that it was actually working. So I was like, okay, how do I do this more? So that's, what leads me to do these things this way. Kind of what leads me here.

[00:04:35] Hector: That's beautiful remember my first sales job. One of the big things that they said is, Don't focus on the features. Focus on the benefits. Don't, don't talk about, you know, how shiny it is. Talk about how it's going to make them feel when they have this shiny thing. And I think the same thing is, it's kind of the same thing, but for services, right?

[00:04:55] Hector: It's just expanded a little bit. But that's kind of what you're saying.

[00:04:58] Michael: It is. And I, it's funny you say that because I use that analogy a lot and part of what I do in consulting and before we design anything for a customer of mine, as far as an identity, I go through that. I help them understand what the differences are between their benefits and their features. And I use the analogy of a Coca Cola can like, you know, Diet Coke, especially Diet Coke's like any other diet or non calorie.

[00:05:19] Michael: No calorie, low calorie beverage drink. comes in a 12 ounce can. It's made out of aluminum. It's got a flip top. it's 12 ounces, you know, all those things are features, the label is a feature I said, but what they really focus in on and getting their customers is bridging the gap between why they should drink, fit in that red dress, drink, without the guilt, those types of, you messaging that they use and advertising that they do really helps set them apart and helps differentiate them between other Diet or low calorie drinks.

[00:05:46] Michael: So benefits are what people make decisions upon as opposed to features. So we really want to hone in on that when we're doing any type of branding or scaling.

[00:05:54] Hector: if they've made this realization, are there any other mistakes or pitfalls that you've seen people make when it comes to the messaging of their services? Are there any horror stories out there that you've seen?

[00:06:08] Michael: Yeah, there are, specifically I can recall, where my customers have, oftentimes named their business, they've decided on marketing channels. they decided on colors, almost like the identity pieces of their business or the brand. I actually don't even have a brand yet.

[00:06:22] Michael: They have a business or an idea. So put a lot of cart before the horse effort into this before they've even identified or really clarified niche market they're marketing to, you know, the people that their products are really going to help, what business problems or personal problems are really going to solve their product or service.

[00:06:37] Michael: that's most common. and it's hard to get ahead of that, in my instance, because Most people are looking for branding after they think they've gone through this whole business proposal, like gone through this whole business plan process. And they think that, okay, now after I figured out all the things I think I need to figure out, now I'm going to brand it.

[00:06:54] Michael: It's like, well, no, you need to talk to a consultant or someone that knows what they're doing before you start making those decisions, because those decisions are going to heavily affect the direction you go in planning your business. Because all of the analysis that you have to do is really, really derivative of the who, the how, the how often, those types of things that come from doing discovery and brand discovery and all those types of things.

[00:07:17] Hector: Yeah, because it seems like a lot of I think a, our listeners are past the entrepreneur phase where they buy the website, they get the LLC, and then it sits there for a year. a lot of 'em have gotten past that, but I think that same thing happens at another sort of level where they do this, they wanna do a rebrand or all of a sudden they, they're launching a new product for our company, we.

[00:07:37] Hector: evolved, we vertically integrated and our core offering really, really changed and our messaging lag behind it for a long time, unfortunately,

[00:07:47] Michael: Yeah, that happens a lot. And I mean, I've had the opportunity to help businesses scale. and they're really in that, three to five years, sometimes a little bit more like seven to 10 year for a frame where they realize they really find out and realize who they are, who they're going after, how they're doing things are being really efficient and they're profitable and they're growing.

[00:08:04] Michael: So now they're like, okay, now we need to pull everything forward to match the growth that they're experiencing. So that happens, but I mean, there's so much pressure on entrepreneurs, especially to get out into the marketplace and to launch. And I do understand that I try to get ahead of them in a sense, as much as I can say, okay, Hey, you don't want, and I do this in my marketing and my messaging style, wasting money on marketing.

[00:08:30] Michael: That doesn't work. there's opportunistic times and opportunities in general to be able to capitalize on what you're offering. However, because of the psychology and because of how fast our minds and our brains work and how fast we're processing information that we see daily. You only have first impressions, sometimes less than first impressions to be successful at that. So it's really important, but we're forgiving people by nature, you know, as human beings. So you oftentimes will have another opportunity to represent yourself, to your customer and your customer base or a new customer. So there's grace in there, thankfully. But lot of people fall into that, I would say that.

[00:09:04] Michael: Rhythm, that flow getting out there and then having to re get out

[00:09:08] Hector: into some of the mechanics of it because you said there's sort of a process and I know kind of even bleeds into more than just graphics and the colors and such. So love to get into that. But one of the things that comes up for it. Especially people listening to our show is this personal branding sort of conversation and how do you differentiate or how do you align the personal brand with the company brand?

[00:09:30] Hector: Is it different? some people, they get very caught up in that sort of conversation. How do you help business leaders approach that sort of thing?

[00:09:39] Michael: so that's a great, great question and a great topic because so many entrepreneurs are infused, in their offer, whatever that might be, if you're doing educational stuff, if you're offering actual product or service. And what I do is I use a method. I call it the 1053 method. I'm not trying to sell it or position it, but I use it.

[00:09:56] Michael: It's what it's called because I help them narrow the focus. And I use a deck of cards, ironically, that have a lot of different words, adjectives and synonyms. And I help them decipher what's really them and what's really up of the business personality. If there's a difference, sometimes they're one of the same because the person that's doing The offer themselves, you know, like a consultant or like my wife in particular, she's a therapist. So it's hard to separate what she's physically doing for someone versus what the messaging of the company is. Well, it's really one of the same. However, there are little, little pieces where you can differentiate.

[00:10:30] Michael: I help my clients, narrow their focus. So they take all that, compiled information they have, all the things they've been thinking and meditating on. And we really refine us. Okay. You have to choose. At least 10. Give me 10. Sometimes there's less. Sometimes there's a lot more.

[00:10:45] Michael: We narrow that to five. right. And then we narrow it to three and we narrow it to one or two if we can. And we utilize that as like a baseline and a filter to start filtering all our other ideas and thoughts. This is okay. Hey, You said you were a, B and C as far as features or benefits or personality, voice and tone.

[00:11:03] Michael: So now that we started expounding on our discovery and our strategy, the messaging that comes behind that and supports those ideas or those positions, they have to support it and they have to be, concrete enough at the gate to where it's not deviate. We're not causing confusions in what we're trying to position or offer the customer.

[00:11:20] Michael: So it really has helped people have a lot of aha moments because it really forces them To simplify. we know we all love choices, but we really, really thrive on simplicity as human beings. So I try to take that psychology into it and use it as much as possible before we design anything.

[00:11:35] Michael: This is before we put pixels in place.

[00:11:38] Hector: yeah, that's a really good just framework that I think people need. They need direction I think so many of them that we work with they've never even thought about the idea of a personal brand, when they got into business, when they started a business, they were, in the boardroom behind closed doors.

[00:11:52] Hector: now the time to kind of come from behind the curtain, if you will, This is really fascinating. Mike, when we get back from break, I'd love to talk about, some more of these frameworks or some more of these methodologies that you use because it seems like, the systems like you've been really able to bring that to, practice.

[00:12:08] Hector: So we're gonna get into that right after this quick break.

[00:12:13] Hector:

[00:12:13] Hector: Hey, y'all. Today's episode is brought to you by Amplify Media, and we are a podcast and content production.

[00:12:18] Hector: Yana, we're going to try it again. Hey, y'all. Today's episode is brought to you by Amplify Media, and we are a podcast and content production company. Well, we like to think of ourselves as platform builders because chances are you probably don't have the design skills, the tech skills that Mike does. And so if that's the case, we can help.

[00:12:31] Hector: Go to amplifymedia. com. That's A M P L A F Y media. com. You can also check the show notes for the link. And with that, let's get back to the show.

[00:12:42] Hector: Mike, there's so much in the magic that you do, but if you could kind of give framework, you mentioned a three part process before when you're looking at, a brand, whether it's a rebrand or starting something new, can you kind of give us that top down high level sort of view and then kind of walk us through some of that process?

[00:12:59] Michael: Sure. Sure. Absolutely. So I like to lead in with my customers when I'm working with them. And, I try to understand just like, you know, you've interviewed me. I try to understand what they're trying to accomplish and, what problem they're really solving, either in the marketplace or for their customer.

[00:13:12] Michael: I like the way one of my idols, if you will, have put it, Neumeyer, who wrote a book called The Brand Gap and, when they zigzag, put it like this. brand is what people say about you when you're not in it. , Um, essentially what that equated to me was your reputation.

[00:13:26] Michael: So we have personal reputations, but also our brand is a reputation. So I lead in with my customers and saying, Hey, what is the one or two words that you want people to think of, when they think of you or likewise, when they say these words, they do think. So for me, the phrase is visual and verbal clarity because yeah, there's a lot of designers out here, but for me, that's what I believe I really helped my clients accomplish.

[00:13:50] Michael: Yeah. So as I go into the framework, we do that first. before we can design anything, we need to understand the words because we use words to communicate as much as images, but words are important. So we need to understand the verbal clarity before we can actually put visual. support to it. I go through a discovery phase with my customers and saying, okay, Hey, let's capture all these words, these words that you think are about your company, your product or service.

[00:14:15] Michael: And some of the words that you didn't even know are attributed to it. And it's curated. Let's put it into cognitive form. And then from there, we are now able to speak intelligently and clearly about what it is you're talking about as a company or business. From there, that's phase one.

[00:14:30] Michael: From there, now we get into the visual identity or the visual clarity because we've curated all this stuff and we understand what and who and how, well, now we can put that into a visual form. So we comps to go through the visual identity design process. And of course, in the discovery phase, if I might backtrack just a smidge, the discovery phase, we're also identifying channels, methods.

[00:14:52] Michael: opportunities for touch points and how people are going to engage with your product service or, or your brand, but you don't really have a brand yet. You think about it, brand is a buzzword, but it's an identifier. It's a reputation. So you don't really have a brand yet. So we have to take time and establish.

[00:15:09] Michael: So that way your brand can be cultivated and people can say, okay, now your brand after X amount of time has gone by. So, you know, the third phase is that implementation and that designing, I go through great lengths depending on the company itself to ensure that, you know, we put these visual creative assets into place.

[00:15:27] Michael: To see what your potential brand looks like when people engage with it in the market. And that's where that Omni comes in. It's a buzzword too, but it really is important because depending on the size of your company, you have an outward brand and you have an inward brand, how your employees, how you're hiring, how are you engaging with the company from the inside looking out versus just your customer base.

[00:15:47] Michael: it's a three headed monster. but it really is in bite sized pieces. thankfully it only takes a short period of time to accomplish that. because a lot of people have really great ideas. It's just, again, not really clear on how to communicate those ideas.

[00:16:00] Hector: Yeah, and I think what you're doing becomes even more important. I just read a stat from a buddy of mine who is one of the leading Google ads experts, but it was a study by Google and it said that a consumer needs seven hours of engagement across 11 touch points in four separate locations.

[00:16:19] Michael: That's pretty interesting. that's a lot more than I would even have thought. but it makes a lot of sense as I reflect, because I think about some of the more notable brands that we're familiar with and. I think of Apple, obviously it's a pretty common one where everybody's familiar with.

[00:16:35] Michael: When you think of Apple or engage with Apple, they're super uber consistent with their brand and their aesthetic. You know, it's clean, it's simple, it's beautifully designed, it's easy to use, you know, they think different. And throughout everything you engage with, you experience that,

[00:16:50] Hector: Yeah, the experience, like you said, is consistent, across all the different channels and wherever they're experiencing it. it's also important for business leaders to think about. Seven hours of content, that's a lot of stuff to fill.

[00:17:03] Hector: It's not just a billboard or a flyer we're trying to fill out or a short, quick commercial. I mean, we have to really think through our business in a way that we can engage someone for that long of a time period.

[00:17:16] Michael: well, you know, was literally thinking about that timeline wise. and I say you mean your audience, right? If you think about how much in the nation we have daily of content, multiple sources, and I'm talking about all of the technology driven resources as well as all the pretty, I want to say mundane or, even archaic, if you will, resources, you know, something as simple as a billboard or poster as you're walking by, or even a packaging of something around the house.

[00:17:43] Michael: Well, I like Apple, especially because something as simple as packaging you're engaging with, so you're getting micro doses, which add up to these seven hours. I would imagine, think as content creators or as people looking to market their business are just market the idea. Think of it in really bite size, almost like micro blinks.

[00:18:01] Michael: you're having opportunities here and there to you. Influence if you will, or to even persuade someone to part ways with their money for what you're offering. It's just micro. I mean, it's very micro some macro of course, but micro everybody doesn't have thousands or even millions of dollars to spend on ads on TV.

[00:18:17] Michael: So you have to be very, cognizant, but also creative, thinking of how you want to engage.

[00:18:28] Hector: Yeah, I was talking with somebody and they were promoting an event. And they were getting caught up because they weren't getting the engagement that they were wanting. And so we were talking about all of the, features. And then we were actually talking about, okay, well, what are the benefits? And there were a few benefits that she had listed out.

[00:18:43] Hector: And what we had said was that, well, each of those benefits is its own micro messaging. Yeah, you have the general messaging, but now you these little spin off adverts or spin off sort of, pieces of content that can also, inform and collectively add to that brand. but if you don't think through those sorts of things, it makes it hard to have that sort of messaging

[00:19:02] Michael: I agree. I mean, I'm not sure if you're familiar with it. I think you might be, cause you're a pretty smart guy, but, Don Miller who wrote the book, story brand, that changed the trajectory of my, practice of helping people brand. He said a couple of really key things and, the three things he said to me or that stuck out to me rather, were brain calories, you know, we're not wasting brain calories.

[00:19:20] Michael: And then the other was surviving and thriving. So psychology wise, are we talking about Maslow's hierarchy needs that we're just getting into real basic psychology of people after designing all around the world for as many years as I have. And for many different industries and different types of products, I really come to realize for myself, we're really not that different people are all very, very, very, very much the same, or very similar, if you will.

[00:19:43] Michael: And really it's surviving or thriving. I'm making decisions every day based on where I am in life. And for these micro, expressions and these micro exposures and touch points, it's really contingent upon, are you helping them survive or thrive? Are you helping them not waste brain calories and making a decision?

[00:20:00] Michael: I mean, he developed a really good formula that are in his books and materials online to help you bridge that gap as a business owner or as an entrepreneur. I put them in practice as well to help others because everybody's not going to read the same material you read.

[00:20:12] Michael: But, it made so much sense to me in those terms. And it's been super successful for me to help people. People just, I have so many aha moments where they're like, Oh man, I didn't think about it like that. I'm like, yeah, I didn't either until I did. And now everything's changed stuff.

[00:20:27] Hector: Really really good stuff here. Mike. I mean, we just scratched the surface here, so, tough to do in one quick drive time episode, but if people want to get deeper in your world, find more about out more about you, where's the best place to do that? Mike.

[00:20:39] Michael: Sure. I would say for now, you can find my work on Behance. It's behance. net slash Michael Begos online, just how it sounds first name, last name online. It's a lot of work there. As far as social, I'm on LinkedIn a bit, so you'll find me at linkedin. com slash MichaelKBigosJr. and then I do have a website.

[00:20:58] Michael: It's focusbranding. com. It's F O C I S branding. com. so those are some things you can get in contact with me specifically, regarding, you branding Thank you for that opportunity to share that too.

[00:21:10] Hector: Yeah,

[00:21:10] Michael: gonna do that.

[00:21:11] Hector: we'll link all that up. I got one more question for you, but we'll link all that up in the show notes as well. in your opinion, Mike, what is the secret to scaling a business?

[00:21:21] Michael: You gotta understand your why. Simon Sinek back in 2009 did his TED talk on why and it seemed so groundbreaking then and of course he's built an enterprise it seems since then. But I read the both books. I read others, of his books and as I, Put it in practice and helped others. I really realized that is a secret, that is a secret sauce that people need to have.

[00:21:43] Michael: You need to understand. Sometimes it's not your personal why only it's the business why, because again, filtering all of your decisions or mostly all your decisions through that Genesis, that nucleus of thought, hiring people, scaling your business decisions, you make where you want to spend money, how you want to market, where you want to market.

[00:22:01] Michael: all of that should be filtered through what you say you believe, it makes a difference. I've seen it multiple times, done brand audits for companies, nonprofits alike. man, when I've helped clients attain that and articulated clearly, it changes everything. It changes everything. if I may, I had one case study where I helped a nonprofit. This guy had five different arms of his nonprofit and the long and short of it is I've been working with him over the years and just doing one off projects with him, flyers or things for his, for his organization.

[00:22:29] Michael: I spent about two weeks with him. We're trying to and reposition the organization. As he was scaling. two weeks, I was like, man, we're in this boardroom. I says, you know, I've been with you two weeks and we've done a lot. We've talked about a lot since I'm still personally, I'm still not sure about what it is we're doing.

[00:22:45] Michael: what is the focus? So 20 minutes, I took them through the Y process of how to find your Y. I took them through, I kind of copied Simon Sinek's method, if you will, and just had conversation. And in 20 minutes, we were on the whiteboard, scribbling, carrying on. And then literally in 20 minutes, Hector, we got it and I was able to write down a wise statement, if you will, a one liner and man, like two weeks later present to the board.

[00:23:09] Michael: We had a whole slide deck. We were at an event where everybody on the board could, could repeat it, articulated, understood what it meant. And also it's such a monumental thing for any organization, no matter how big or small everyone should be able to repeat it. And because everyone was able to repeat it when asked, well, what is it you guys do?

[00:23:27] Michael: Well, they were able to say it. And really what it encompassed is, here's the problem we solve, here's what we solve it for, and here's the successful outcome of what this produces. And that was it. And it just works. Time over and time over, it works.

[00:23:42] Hector: Love that. Yeah. Simon Sinek's book. Go read it if you haven't. Go get connected with Mike. And, I want to thank all of you listeners for sticking with us today. We would be forever grateful for a rating or review wherever you get your podcasts. And if you know someone who needs to hear this, I hit that share button, send them a message.

[00:23:58] Hector: Let them know you were thinking about them. And as always, we appreciate you being part of the tribe. We'll see on the next one. Later y'all.