How Albano Gega is Attracting Top Emerging Tech Talent

[00:00:00] Hector: Of the Tanner was one of the few who, um, went the other way. He got pulled into being a full-time podcaster, got signed by a network. He's getting a, I, you know, I don't know what the arrangements were. It's not public, but is now being a, you know, is a, is a, a professional podcaster and is one of the people who kind of slung it out in the indie space and, uh, slung it out as an indie podcaster.

[00:00:24] Hector: Um, did a lot of things right. Had to put, it, was putting out a show every single day. And, um, And then he, you know, he had all the success come from it. So I wanna, I wanna give you credence to that, Tanner. Cause I don't think I've ever done that. Um, and, and having you in person is an honor here and I think that you are, uh, are a great example to podcasters who, who like wanna make it right.

[00:00:42] Hector: You know, a lot of them think that, oh, the Joe Rogan's. You don't have to be the Joe Rogan. You could be the Tanner Campbell and, or maybe not, I don't know. But anyway,

[00:00:49] Tanner: Tanner, please don't start that. ,

[00:00:52] Hector: thanks for being here, dude. Is there anything relevant to, um, the, the focus of today's q and a is, this is production week, this is where, you know, we're gonna talk about where, you know, what is, what does that production cycle look like, right?

[00:01:05] Hector: And kind of the, the various pieces and components. And one, one reason I thought that you would be great to have on is for a couple reasons. I know that you have a sound background. Um, so you have a lot of, you know, background in, in audio, you know, engineering or, uh, you can kind of ex uh, expand on that a little bit.

[00:01:18] Hector: But then also you were putting out a show every single day. And I know that that is no, no joke. And you were, if I'm not mistaken, you were like writing, recording, editing and publishing, like all in the same day and you did. For an extended period of time, a significant amount of time, grew a successful show, one of the top shows, um, in the, in the podcasting space.

[00:01:38] Hector: And even in the business space on a, a variety of the charts. So I thought that you'd be a great person to come in and, uh, you know, speak about the, the production process as a whole. Is there any other bits of, of, of relevancy or bits to your experience that you think might fill in the gaps as to why you, you know, you didn't wake up one day and all of a sudden know how to edit and produce

[00:01:58] Tanner: podcasts?

[00:01:59] Tanner: Oh, uh, well actually I did so long, no. Um, so, uh, when I was, I like to joke that I was the first podcaster ever and people look at me cross-eyed and they say, what do you, what do you mean you're not the first podcaster ever? That was, you know, Dave or some somebody else. When I was, um, gosh, I don't know, it must have been like 1988.

[00:02:23] Tanner: So I was young. We had this little play school tape recorder. Remember it with the cheap microphone and the phone cable that connected to the cassette deck. And we watched a show called Pound Puppies, my sister and I, and we would watch Pound puppies and then we would record our take of the episode, and then we would go take it to my grandmother.

[00:02:44] Tanner: And if that's not a podcast, in its earliest form, I don't know what is. Um, but I wasn't like, I, in no way in my formative years being educated through pub, the public school system, did I have any interest in audio. But, um, in 2010, podcasting came across my radar as a creative medium. And I just, I didn't think of myself as an artist.

[00:03:09] Tanner: I didn't think of myself, and I still don't, by the way, I'm not leading up to that. Uh, I didn't really think of myself as creative, but I thought because I had an IT background at that point, I was a director of IT at a managed service provider at the time, I thought, Maybe audio. I like to talk and I like to write and I'm techy enough to do this podcasting thing cuz you still had to, there weren't really podcast hosting providers in 2010, like Libson was there, but it was mostly like blog talk radio and it wasn't normalized yet.

[00:03:40] Tanner: So you still had to kinda like make your own r s s feed. And I thought, well I'm techy enough to do that so maybe I can be creative do doing this. And, and I just took to it like a duck to water. As far as being the center of attention, , I guess I liked that part of it. Um, and I didn't get good at audio until I had been doing podcasting in this very unprofessional, you know, jokester dude in the basement with his friend's kind of style.

[00:04:05] Tanner: Even though I had no friends or a basement, cause I lived in Florida. Um, but over time, because I cared so much about the technical aspect of it, because that was where I felt I had had skill was, uh, technical, not necessarily entertaining or being smart. I got good at editing and engineering. Through what was probably five years of, you know, first I used Audacity, and then I used Reaper, and then I got into, uh, uh, pro Tools.

[00:04:33] Tanner: And then in 2015, maybe 2014, I had had a few podcasts that were, you know, successful by the measure of the day. You know, I had this one podcast that had hundred thousand downloads an episode, but it was also when we were using weizer stats. So like, that wasn't real, but I thought it was real. I thought it was really good.

[00:04:52] Tanner: Um, and I had some people come to me and they said, Hey, your podcast sounds good. Can you make our podcast sound good? And this is way before I, I mean this is before any of these solutions, like, um, squad Cast or Riverside existed. So everybody was pretty much using Skype at the time and the audio wasn't great.

[00:05:12] Tanner: Uh, and I said, yeah, sure, but if it sucks, you know, don't hold me to it. Because I don't think I, like, I didn't think I was good. I knew that I had was fast, but I didn't necessarily know that fast equaled good. And I don't think it does. But in my case, I was good enough that the people who were paying me $30 an episode, which is embarrassing to even admit now, uh, to edit their podcast, that they were happy and that grew into, uh, between then between 2015 and 2017 when I moved to Maine from Florida, I had accrued enough clientele and enough of a skillset to take a little bit of a risk and open up a brick and mortar studio.

[00:05:55] Tanner: I say a little bit of a risk, I guess that's a pretty big one. Uh, and then I realized then because of the type of clientele who came to me in Maine, partially because I was the only guy who was doing podcasting in Maine and offering that in a studio setting, and partially because I was good at it, I would get a great clientele.

[00:06:12] Tanner: Like I, I worked with Joan London, I worked with. Uh, like me, insurance company, like I, I would just get, I got a couple of like Hollywood level gigs and it dawned on me that I was actually good at audio en engineering, but I wasn't necessarily good at, I didn't think I was terrific at marketing podcasts, right?

[00:06:32] Tanner: I didn't, in the same way that I didn't know I was good at audio engineering until I started getting good clients. I didn't realize I was good at podcast marketing until people said, how did you get your podcast? Because I could launch a podcast and within like a month, I'd be getting a thousand downloads a week no matter what the content was.

[00:06:51] Tanner: Like. That was really easy for me to do and from, from my experience because I wasn't formally a marketer, right? I was just a guy who had tech jobs and now I owned a studio. And I had done some marketing for myself and I kind of like figure it out as you go kind of way. But I didn't realize I was good at marketing until somebody said, Hey, uh, the average podcaster has a hundred downloads per episode in the first 30 days.

[00:07:13] Tanner: And I'm like, whoa, there's gotta be something wrong there. And people would say that, no, there's nothing wrong there. You're just doing something really good with your marketing, so maybe you should start talking about that and start writing about it. So in, I don't know, I think 2018 or 2019, I really came on the radar as somebody who was able to help people grow stuff.

[00:07:32] Tanner: And then my, my quote unquote kind of micro career and podcasting as a consultant kind of exploded out. And you talked about, um, production. I know I went a little bit off the rails there cause I'm trying to give, uh, somewhat of a complete history. Production for me is, I'm a d h D I don't know if anybody has that, who's, who's, uh, listening.

[00:07:52] Tanner: But, uh, it's very difficult for me to commit to a schedule. So something that I thought I should do right away was make a promise to a bunch of people, that I was gonna be consistent. And that kind of forced me to become consistent in my production schedule. To this day is, I wa for example, today's Monday, I went to, uh, my favorite coffee shop, St.

[00:08:14] Tanner: Mark's here in Denver. Uh, and I sat there from six 30 to about noon, and I wrote, I think I meant 4,500 words worth of, uh, script for the entire week. And then tomorrow, Tuesday, I will perform all those scripts and engineer and edit all those scripts. And you made a really big deal about that being, uh, difficult.

[00:08:33] Tanner: Uh, it's a daily podcast. It's so much work. My podcasts are only 10 minutes long, so in reality, It seems like a lot, but you know, I'm doing seven episodes a week. If they're 10, you know, I'm doing an hour podcast the same as most people do. So it's, it's not, I think something that gets in a lot of people's heads when they first start out is, my podcast has gotta be 60 minutes long, or it's gotta be 45, you know, to mirror radio.

[00:08:56] Tanner: Uh, and so in that way that I, I couldn't do an hour episode every day. That, that would be crazy. . Yeah.

[00:09:04] Hector: So we are going to save the second half of the q and a for, you know, to, to you guys to open up. If you guys have any that come up, feel free to throw 'em in the chat and I'll try and weave them in here.

[00:09:14] Hector: Um, Tanner, when it comes to production, I think what, there's a lot of components, right? There's a lot of pieces, and it can be as, as, as big of a well or as deep of a well as you want it to be. How, how do you look at the production process? Or are there any big buckets or, or pillars or, you know, key components of making the podcast

[00:09:37] Tanner: go?

[00:09:39] Tanner: I think script writing is so important. I, I think a lot of people feel they're gonna get behind the mic and wing it, and some people are very good at that. I think most people are terrible at that. Um, and I think when people hear writing they think, okay, I'm gonna have to script the whole thing. I'm gonna have to read.

[00:09:56] Tanner: And then there's this concern that when you read, you sound like you're reading. And that takes away from the experience for the listener. And for some people that's true. Some people cannot read without sounding like they're reading. Um, the more practice you get in in it, the less you sound that way. But I've also helped people to script just in bullet points, I have this theory that pretty much every podcast that doesn't use scripting of some kind, whether it's structured segments or bullet points or, or full out scripts, that they probably are wasting about 10 to 15 minutes of the listener's time in every episode because they're, I'm not saying this of your group here, obviously cuz they're working with you.

[00:10:34] Tanner: Uh, but it's common that. Podcasters won't edit. Uh, and when you don't edit, on top of allowing for this kind of weird flexibility in your quote unquote programming, there's probably 15 minutes, 10 minutes worth of fluff in every episode. And that is, that has always communicated to me a disrespect of the listener's time, um, because the listener is choosing to listen to you.

[00:10:58] Tanner: Of the too many podcasts that exist at this point, I mean, it's an insane number. I, somebody said 5 million the other day and only like, uh, 700,000 of them are even active. So people are going out of their way to give you some of their most precious commodity, their time, and you're just playing fast and loose.

[00:11:18] Tanner: And I don't, I don't think that's respectful. And I don't think, ultimately, I don't think that it earns the loyalty that a show needs, uh, to, to make it in the long term. Financially speaking, I, I'm hugely a capitalist, very financially motivated with all of the shows that I produce. I think making money is.

[00:11:36] Tanner: If you make money, you can commit more fully. If you can commit more fully, you can do more good. So the money is really important to me. Uh, I know that's a hurdle for a lot of people. Um, but you have, if, if your goal is to make this a full-time endeavor, respecting the listeners' time is a, is huge. It

[00:11:55] Hector: seems like you have your days where scripting is one kind of, it seems like it's, it's one modality, one kind of brain, you know, part of your brain, the word and recording.

[00:12:04] Hector: And it seems like you do the recording and editing at the same time. Or what are the, do you have other themes for the days or how does the, the Rex, the rest of the publishing process, PREA publishing Pro process

[00:12:17] Tanner: play out? Yeah, so. Man, I feel like I might be setting a bad example by even saying, this is what I do, but you're asking, so this is what I do.

[00:12:24] Tanner: Um, yeah. Mondays I do that and Tuesdays I talked about. I do the editing and engineering. Uh, and I'm always a week ahead. So by the time I get to Wednesdays, Wednesdays are the days that I, by the way, when you script the editing becomes so much easier because you're reading a script and so it's you're less likely to have something come up that you wish you hadn't said.

[00:12:47] Tanner: Cuz you're reading a script. So I have, my editing is even a lot easier because I'm scripted, but on Wednesdays, I'll take everything together. I've already got the transcripts cuz I'm scripted. I'll drop 'em all into megaphone, uh, glass Box uses megaphone. So that's, that's where I'm uploading my audio files to.

[00:13:04] Tanner: I'll drop 'em all into megaphone, I'll schedule 'em all. I'll show note. Them all show notes are really easy because they're really just the first paragraph of, you know, whatever my script was, the first couple lines. Uh, and then the same copy pasted links because, except for Wednesdays. Cuz Wednesdays I have guests.

[00:13:21] Tanner: Um, but same copy paste links from the last episode. And while Megaphone doesn't do this, uh, some hosting providers do, they allow you to have a templated show notes. So every time you load a new episode, it prepopulates with just. The show notes you always use. So you don't have to do that copy paste thing.

[00:13:38] Tanner: I think, uh, I think Captivate does that, that's a tool that Captivate and Transistor I think also has that. Um, so I drop everything in there, schedule, schedule it out, choose all the ad locations. Um, actually the ad locations are chosen mostly by glass Box, but on Wednesdays I have to ping the, the mid rolls.

[00:13:55] Tanner: They set the pre-rolls and the post rolls. Uh, and then after Wednesday I am done with all things podcasting. Everything's scheduled, everything's good to go. I'm one week ahead from the Monday. Uh, and then for the remainder of Wednesday, I conduct the interview for the fall, the week after the following week.

[00:14:14] Tanner: Um, and on Thursday and Friday are my heavy reading study and writing days cuz I also. Write for Stoic Gym Magazine. Uh, and for modern stoicism. And I'm also in class at the College of of Stoic philosophers because, well, I have to be , uh, because if, if I speak wrong on the podcast, I kind of, I kind of get in trouble.

[00:14:36] Tanner: So, uh, Monday through Wednesday is kind of like the, all the work I do. And then the rest of it is all the learning and writing and education part of what I do, cuz it's kinda an ongoing process. Um, and again, I feel like that probably seems like a very overwhelming schedule. As I say it out loud, I even feel like I sound a little insane that that's what I do every week.

[00:14:54] Tanner: But, um, that's what I do. Yeah. Well, well

[00:14:59] Hector: I think it's great because you set the example of what is a, a full-time podcaster, you know, what's the schedule look like? And I think it's h how rigorous is that? And then what was, what was that process putting in that, that scheduling system.

[00:15:14] Tanner: Uh, a lot trial and error.

[00:15:15] Tanner: I started just by doing. I would wake up in the morning, write record, edit, engineer schedule. But when I did that I was just, I was always, I was always living with the production cycle and that wasn't good because if I got sick, I had no flexibility. And of course when you do a daily show, like if you just randomly take off a Thursday, most people don't even notice cuz they're not caught up.

[00:15:36] Tanner: Cuz most listeners won't listen every day. They'll listen on Thursday to like the five episodes that they haven't listened to all week. Um, so there's a little bit of flexibility, but I just found myself in a really vulnerable spot. And the spot that I had told millions of not millions, thousands of podcasters not to get themselves into, which is to be in real time with your production schedule for that exact reason.

[00:15:55] Tanner: Your kid gets sick, something happens. My dog was throwing up when I was supposed to start this. You know, like that sort of stuff just happens. So I stopped doing every day, and then I tried to do maybe across a couple days, and that ran into the same problem because with the college and the writing, I just found that these unexpected things would pop up too frequently throughout the entirety of the week.

[00:16:21] Tanner: That I couldn't do it on more than one. I couldn't com, I couldn't do it across a spectrum of days. I had to do it on a single day. And writing's the hardest part. I mean, six 30. So I spent about six or seven hours writing. But the rest of the work I described probably doesn't even take eight hours, probably, because like I said, the e the, the episodes are only 10 minutes long, so they're probably 15 minutes long, raw, and there's less editing to do because I'm.

[00:16:52] Tanner: So there's no, there's not really many mistakes to fix. And I've got templates saved within my da I use Studio One from Personas, and so I just apply the same EQ and the same, all the other stuff. And it's just, I literally just dragged the DR. Audio in there, fixed a couple of mistakes where I fucked up and then I'm done.

[00:17:09] Tanner: Um, so it was really trial and error. It was, and it was also trying to work with my brain, which is sometimes too fast for its own good and very forgetful. Uh, a d H people, A d h, ADHD people have a very hard time remembering things. And so I kind of had to do, I couldn't do exactly what I wanted, which was I wanted to be so efficient.

[00:17:28] Tanner: I could wake up every day at 6:00 AM have all my work done by like 10, and then the rest of the day would be free. And I'd be living the life of luxury. I'd have so much free time to do whatever I wanted. Um, but my brain wouldn't let me do that. So, uh, that's kind of how I fell into this production schedule, which may be well advisory advised, I'm not sure.

[00:17:45] Tanner: Yeah.

[00:17:47] Hector: One, one thing of our ethos here though, at podcast AMA is that there's no, there's no prescriptive, no, no prescription. There's only just choices, right? It's, and it's a, it's a buffet. And so, you know, our thing is to take what you do, you take what you want and leave what you don't. And I think it's a, it's a great model though.

[00:18:04] Hector: When it comes to Brian here, he said, speaking of microphones, uh, he's, he's curious about some recommendations there, but I'm curious about how you look at the equipment side of the equation and how that plays into, you know, I don't know if you had to give it a percentage or a piece of the pie, you know, what and how big the role of the equipment plays in this whole

[00:18:28] Tanner: thing.

[00:18:29] Tanner: Uh, when I was an audio engineer, you're gonna make me hate myself for saying what I'm saying right now. Um, clearly I care to a large degree, I'm sitting in a $10,000 booth with a $500 microphone. So I, I can't sit here and pretend like I don't think it's important. Um, what I can say is that, With very minimal effort, one can exceed the expectations of most podcast listeners.

[00:18:53] Tanner: And when I say minimal effort, I mean minimal cost because most podcasters have a shitty condenser microphone like a Yeti. I'm so sorry. I should have thought that some of you might have that before. I said that, uh, that was a judgment and I'm sorry that it came across that way. We, we've already covered it here before.

[00:19:08] Tanner: No worries. Okay. All right. Um, a lot of people who are not you people, uh, will have, you know, they're microphones like this far away and they're not in a treated environment, so that's a problem and it's a condenser, so that's a problem. And, um, really all you have to do is find a reasonable dynamic microphone that probably, if it's a usb, it's probably gonna cost around $200 is probably the spend for a good one.

[00:19:33] Tanner: Although, uh, a KG has a new one out that's a U USB that I think is only like 130 or maybe it's a hundred. Um, All you have to remember to do is like, just get close to the mic, , point it at the corner of your mouth, be about this close to it. Reduce or rather increase your, um, signal to noise ratio. Uh, so your de-noise can do a better job.

[00:19:55] Tanner: And it doesn't even really matter at that point what microphone you're using or what space you're in. I'm in this space because I do, I still from time to time to do audiobook work. Um, but I am planning on relocating to Portugal actually this summer for a couple years to not be on either side of our election process.

[00:20:13] Tanner: I feel like it's gonna be a fucking circus and I would rather be somewhere else while that was going on. I can vote from afar. Um, and when I get there, I will probably not, I mean, I'm not gonna take this with me, which is ironic because it was shipped from Portugal. I should have just moved there and then got it.

[00:20:27] Tanner: Um, but I will probably just be in a, in a room with a couple of acoustic panels and a microphone, something like this. And I think people overthink it. It's not the equipment, it's the technique. It is important to remember to choose a dynamic microphone over a condenser just because a condenser is expecting to be in a place like this and a dynamic is expecting to be in an imperfect or live environment alive in the literal sense and live in like the bouncy, very vibrant room kind of sense.

[00:20:58] Tanner: Uh, so condensers tend to be super sensitive. Um, so as long as you pick a dynamic microphone and you practice good, the assure MV seven is a great microphone, two 40. That's great. It is getting pricier. I don't know if that's part of the whole chip thing that's going on that's making everything expensive, but uh, that's a great microphone.

[00:21:15] Tanner: I actually just bought one for one of the people on my team who's in the uk and it just sounds like a million bucks. And he's in, you know, he's in a room that's just, and, and maybe a lot of you are in this sort of room, it's just an empty office space or bedroom in his house, . And because he practices good mic technique and because that is a very good mic, he sounds great on it.

[00:21:35] Tanner: And it's easy to use. Um, so I love that Mike. I love the, uh, what is it? The a t r 2040 I think is the new one from, uh, audio Technica. They make a really good one, but if you're spending like 150 bucks on a u sb microphone or even a sure m no sure m v seven, but a uh, sure SM 58 on the XLR side. If you've got that set up, that's a hundred dollars mic and that's really good too.

[00:21:58] Tanner: I started my studio with nothing but a Zoom live track L 12 and four Sure SM 58 s. And I did work for two Hollywood films with those microphones, uh, for dial for automated dialogue replacement. And if it's good enough for that is good enough for our low bit rate. , you know, streamed live fucking audio on the internet.

[00:22:23] Tanner: People really overthink this and it drives me crazy cuz they spend so much money and it's the, the equipment doesn't fix the problem. It's, it's all performance and content.

[00:22:34] Hector: We might circle back with some, some specifics on that. Cause I think the mic technique is a good thing. What about when it comes to editing?

[00:22:40] Hector: You know, there's so many, you mentioned all the softwares. There's free, there's expensive. Mm-hmm. , do you have a, a similarly, um, I don't know, top down view about what's important when it comes to all of those, you know, seemingly gadgets and gizmos and, and kind of the, well that someone can go down if

[00:22:56] Tanner: they want to.

[00:22:57] Tanner: Uh, yeah, I know that. How do most people here use Audacity? Is that what most everybody's using? Do we know? I think,

[00:23:04] Hector: I think there's a, there's a, a mix of audacity, garage band still, and Des is what is what we're hearing. Okay. People coming around too. Um,

[00:23:12] Tanner: if

[00:23:13] Hector: you guys can throw in your editing software in the chat, maybe that might be

[00:23:16] Tanner: valuable too.

[00:23:16] Tanner: God damn. Logic Pros that, that's, that's a tough thing to walk in as a independent podcast or be using Logic Pro. Uh, studio One. I love Studio one. Kevin. Oh, Kevin, I know you Kevin, are you here? Where are you?

[00:23:31] Tanner: I know Kevin. Yeah, I sent you a message. I'm sure you probably didn't even realize that it was Kevin. I trained you as an audio engineer. . Oh, I'm working with Hector. It's Hector. Matt. I, I'm, I'm not, I, yeah, I'm here, man. What's up? It's funny. It's good to see you. Um, I was gonna say, nobody uses the studio when I was so surprised to see that, um, yes.

[00:23:53] Tanner: I even use Studio one before I worked with you though. Oh, is that true? Yeah, absolutely. 100%. Studio one is the, is the top. Uh, I love it. So, um, the suggestions, I think that, Most dos are created equal. And when, when I talk about dolls, I'm excluding script and I'm dis I'm excluding audacity. And that is not to speak ill of them, but they are technically not by definition, they are not digital audio workstations.

[00:24:20] Tanner: They are, uh, one is a tech, a word, processor based audio editor, which is, which is amazing. It's fucking incredible what the script can do. Um, although I hate it as an audio engineer because I worked very hard to learn the things I know and that damn thing does it magically. Uh, and then there's, uh, audacity, which is an, it's an audio editor.

[00:24:41] Tanner: That's what it is. And, and it's biggest drawback is that it doesn't have, uh, live processing of plugins or, or it didn't used to, unless something has changed since it was acquired by that German company that now owns it. Um, So I, I'm biased because I use Studio One every day, but Studio One is, has an extremely customizable keyboard.

[00:25:02] Tanner: It does live processing of plugins, uh, and it's very lightweight. And as far as other products are concerned, with the exception of Logic Pro, because Logic Pro, anybody who has an Apple knows you pay once, you never pay again. So that's probably the best setup other than free. Uh, but Studio One I think is, I wanna say it's like $12 a month, or you can buy the, what are your,

[00:25:27] Hector: go ahead.

[00:25:27] Hector: What are the things that you're looking for? Do when you're like in a do, when you go, okay, it needs to get, it needs to have this, it needs, I'm looking, you

[00:25:34] Tanner: know, you wanna hear the stupidest fucking reason that I picked this, this doll. Cuz they really are the same. Like if it's, if it's um, Adobe, whatever Adobe's is, what is their, it's called, I can't even remember.

[00:25:43] Tanner: Audition if it's audition's weird just because Adobe's not an audio company. Um, and it's a weird layout to me, but it does the same shit and, uh, avid Pro Tools does it and Studio One does it and Cubase does it for me, I'm really big on, and I say the same thing ironically, I've never made this connection, but I say the same thing about hosting providers.

[00:26:08] Tanner: It's like they all, they all do the job. And for me the reason, cause I started with Audacity. I went to Pro Tools. I used Pro Tools for the longest time. And I think part of that was I wanted to be a pro and the pros use Pro Tools. It's in the name, right? Like that's kind of what I thought. And then I got so bored with how Pro Tools looked because it was just boring looking.

[00:26:29] Tanner: It just looked like Windows 3.1 to me. And I got tired of seeing all these screenshots of like Logic Pro with these colorful tracks. And you know, my A D H D brain, of course is like, this is way more exciting. I want one that looks like this. And Studio One looked like that and it was affordable. And when I went to go use it, the keyboard was fully customizable.

[00:26:49] Tanner: I could even map to system keys, like tab and control, uh, uh, tab and command and option on my Mac, which a lot of programs that run on Mac won't allow you to write to those keys because they're system keys. And so with just one hand and the other hand on the mouse tab, caps, lock, shift and control are the only keys I ever need to touch other than the space bar to, to advance the playhead and play back what I'm hearing.

[00:27:16] Tanner: So I was able to customize the keyboard in Pro to, uh, in, um, Studio one from Personas. So, so well that it, I'm incredibly fast in it, uh, not to toot my own horn, but, uh, it be, it, when I tried to become fast in Audacity, I wanted to die because Audacity just seems like it, it, it was never fast to me. And when I tried to become fast in Pro Tools, pro Tools is just, it's, it's a great program, but it's a little clunky and it ha it's always been that way.

[00:27:47] Tanner: And so I just fell in love with Studio One first because of how it looked and second, because of how I could customize it. And I think that what it comes down to when you're picking a doll, when you're choosing a doll, I should say, is what are you comfortable with? What do you feel competent with? It's not really about which one's the right one.

[00:28:02] Tanner: It's about. Which one do you feel most Right. Using? And if that's, you know, if that's script, you know, fuck it, it's script. And if it's audacity, then that's what it is. Um, but I, I would, I would suggest experimenting. I mean, all of these dolls except Logic Pro, I don't think it comes with a trial. It might though.

[00:28:19] Tanner: Um, all of the ones that I've mentioned in Q Base and everything, they all come with like a 30 day trial. So, you know, why not screw around and, and, you know, cheat on your doll a little bit and see if you can find some greener grass on the other side. We're gonna go to Tommy.

[00:28:38] Hector: What's your

[00:28:38] Tanner: question? Uh, thanks, Tanner.

[00:28:41] Tanner: First time listener. Longtime, uh, caller. Hey, uh, first of all, . Yeah, I'm, I'm trying to, I'm trying to be, I'm trying to get on his heels. We're we're the number two. He's the number one. I got a long way to go. Uh, everywhere I travel, I dunno if you can tell. I mean, yeah, I can see that. Yeah. Everywhere.

[00:29:01] Tanner: Everywhere I go, I'm in, uh, where am I? Winnipeg. I'm in Winnipeg this week. So that book comes with me everywhere. Uh, number two, uh, Tanner, I live in Greeley, Colorado. Would love to maybe come down, have some coffee with you. Number three. Uh, after listening to you, it sounds like I have the world's shittiest show.

[00:29:20] Tanner: Uh, I have the wrong microphone. Uh, I think I'm the only one using a garage band. And, uh, I, I, I will admit I ramble, but when I am doing the rambling, there's a point to it on every single one of my, uh, 241 episodes. Okay. So one thing I started thinking about after listening to you, Tanner, is number one, to see if I can jump out this window, but, It's fucking snowing.

[00:29:51] Tanner: Screw that. Uh, number two is, uh, and I was speaking with Dave about this a while back, is to totally shut down my podcast and start over, but I still want to say, use the same brand that Hector and I have been talking about. So what, what tips, advice are you gonna give me? Who's freaking out? Because everything you've said and you're so successful, Tanner, and my dream for 2023 is to, uh, take the podcast and, uh, make it a full-time gig.

[00:30:26] Tanner: And, uh, I will shut up now and turn off the microphone and just, Well, so I wanna be careful here about, you know, saying that I'm an expert in this. I've had some success. I'm currently experiencing some success that could all go down the toilet tomorrow. I'm creating revenue verticals left and right to make sure that it doesn't just in case.

[00:30:44] Tanner: Um, but the truth about finding success in podcasting is that there is an X factor that no guru who has ever existed in podcasting can for certain identify for you. W what we know that successful podcasts have are good co-host dynamics. They're consistent. Uh, they have, they build community, they cross promote.

[00:31:06] Tanner: They're active within the communities they serve outside of just their show. We know they have those things, but there are plenty of podcasts who have those things who are never successful. So the fact that my podcast is successful is an indication that I have an X factor, but I don't know what it is.

[00:31:22] Tanner: Uh, and so there's no, there's no. Equation that if you have this plus this over this times this, that you're gonna get success. I just wanna make that really clear. I take only partial credit for my success cuz there is absolutely an XFactor and some luck involved things I can't even teach to replicate.

[00:31:40] Tanner: With that said, can I ask you what your podcast is about? So the podcast is called Blending the Family and the foundation was about how to create a successful blended family. But, um, after, like I said, 241 shows, it's morphed into, uh, more on the side of, uh, fatherhood, men's mental health, um, you know, divorce, I mean, it's still within a blended family space, but, you know, some of the topics have been a little bit, uh, off topic.

[00:32:15] Tanner: Um, but it, it still fits the whole genre of blending the family. If somebody was going, if somebody was sitting in their podcast player, let's just, for sake of argument, assume that it's Apple Podcasts. Um, what would they search to find your, your kind of content? What do you think they would search? Uh, divorce is the name.

[00:32:41] Tanner: Are any of those things in the title of your show? Uh, well, family, are they searching for family? Is that the kinda person? Yeah. Is that, is that what you think they're searching for? If they're looking for you?

[00:32:56] Tanner: Like I said, I've done 2 40, 241 episodes. I am, I am too old right now to rebrand the whole thing. I am, uh, you know, if, if I could quite honestly, Tanner, I, I started a podcast on, on Anchor, just called Tommy Maloney podcast. Mm-hmm. . And that, you know, it was, as I traveled, I would do it. So I, if I have to rebrand, my wife would divorce me because it would be, it would be a brand new website.

[00:33:33] Tanner: It would be, um, you know, having to revamp everything. And I am, like I said, Tanner, I am not motivated to have to go through that. And so I love my logo, I love what I've built, but it's like you said, it's the X factor. I mean, I could be totally wrong. So this is, this is na, this is, this is always a hard thing to talk about because it's heartbreaking.

[00:34:08] Tanner: Um, discovery in podcasting almost entirely doesn't exist with the exception of within Spotify because Spotify acquired a discovery engine about a year and a half ago now, and I know that because I worked for that discovery engine and I was part of that acquisition. So they have that technology. And now you might notice if you're a Spotify user, you are given recommendations to podcasts that for some reason in the same way that you're given recommendations for music, seem to line up with other things you listen to.

[00:34:38] Tanner: Apple is doing something to try. They're, they don't have a discovery engine in the formal sense of deployed algorithms, but they do have a discovery engine in a way of like, okay, this is in the same category, so maybe you would like this, but they're not studying the behavior of their listeners, which means they don't understand what suggestions make the most amount of relevant sense to the person they're suggesting it to.

[00:35:02] Tanner: What this means is outside of the Spotify ecosystem, which is mostly people under 30, Which are not, probably, probably not gonna be most of your demographic. Um, it means that search is is the number one way, not word of mouth. I don't care what Tom Webster says. We've had that argument before. Uh, search is the number one way that someone's gonna come across your show.

[00:35:27] Tanner: The reason that my show has the word stoicism in it, Is because people are searching for stoicism. And if you pop open any podcast player app and you type in stoicism, mine is either number one or number two next to Ryan's. When I had Good Morning podcasters, the reason I had podcasters in the title was because if somebody was searching for a podcast about podcasting, they would probably put podcasters in the search query.

[00:35:52] Tanner: If you've got a, if you've got a podcast about golf, don't call it John and Jennifer hit the back nine, even though that's a clever name, because the, because they're never gonna see it. They're gonna be searching for it. And if the words in the title aren't in the search query, they're not gonna see it.

[00:36:09] Tanner: They'll never find it. So it might just be that all of your lack of discovery for your podcast is just because the queries that are relevant to the content don't have a nexus at the title. So maybe all you have to do is change the title. And then forward the existing domain name to a new domain name you buy for $12 a year.

[00:36:31] Tanner: Don't change anything else. Just change the title of the podcast. You know, what is it called right now? Blending the Family. So maybe blended parenting. It's worth a shot to see if that does anything, because then people who are searching for parenting, you have that in your title. Now you, this is something that's similar to how you do keyword research in Google.

[00:36:56] Tanner: You, you, uh, enter in a query and then Google tells you how popular that query is and how competitive that search keyword is. Unfortunately, we don't have that in podcasting because nobody wants to build it for us. Uh, so we have to kind of, we have to play a little bit of a guessing game. So what I would do is I would, if I were you, I would try to find podcasts that are, and I would do this within the Apple e.

[00:37:21] Tanner: Try to find podcasts that are, do you know who you're com I'm, I'm gonna use the word competitor, but that's not what I mean, but you'll know what I mean. Do you have people who are in your space who are doing the same thing you're doing? Oh, definitely. Are any of them popular? Uh, I wouldn't say like, have you ever seen 'em on a trending page or anything like that?

[00:37:40] Tanner: No. Do you, do you, um, have a, do you have a, an image in your head of a podcast that's successful in this space that you're like, I really wish I was doing as well as they are? Uh, no. It's, it's hard to mark, it's hard to market research that then, because we, we don't know what, what's a title of one in your space?

[00:38:03] Tanner: Oh, I know there's one that's, uh, something blended. I mean, there's other blended family genres in the space. Do you have a name of one? Can you think of one? I, I can't think of one.

[00:38:19] Hector: Is he going too narrow here, Tanner, with the blended family. And, and also, what about the idea of, uh, a subtitle or adding, have you seen that, you know, blended the family and then adding your keywords at the end of that is

[00:38:32] Tanner: that is you can actually get in trouble for that.

[00:38:35] Tanner: Uh, apple will consider that depending on how abusive you are with it as keyword stuffing in the title. And they will, they will deprioritize your, um, uh, your search, your search engine result page within the app. Um, becau because you're doing that, they're very wise to that. So, Really podcast title, having a keyword that is central.

[00:38:56] Tanner: I literally just including parenting in your title may fix a lot of your problems. Now you wouldn't know for three months, but that is a cheap, free, you know, very not inconvenient change to make, to discover if that's the thing that's really holding the show back from being, uh, discovered. Um, are you doing any advertising for the show?

[00:39:15] Tanner: You said your wife was gonna kill you, so probably not or more Well, the only, I mean we're, the only advertising I do is I promote my coaching and I promote my books, but I don't, I mean, I don't have any ads, if that's what, uh, you're asking. Yeah, I would, I would add parenting to your title in, in some way, and then I would go buy a $12 domain with the new.

[00:39:40] Tanner: Forward the old one to the new one and keep everything else the same. Don't change the, you know, don't change the artwork if you don't have to. Maybe you don't even have to. Don't change the, don't change any of the old episode titles. Don't change the intro. Don't spend any money. Just see if that one change over the course of three months creates any difference in traction for growth over the course of those 90 days.

[00:40:03] Tanner: Okay. Thank you, sir, and I'm looking forward to buying you coffee . All right. For sure. We could talk more about it. Rizk, let's go to you, man.

[00:40:17] Tanner: You're

[00:40:17] Hector: muted, sir. You're muted,

[00:40:18] Tanner: sir. Of course. Um, hello Tanner. Um, my question is around, uh, daily podcasts. I'm thinking of starting one, and, uh, I know you shared about, uh, batching. That's a great way to, um, to make sure that you can keep things organized and, um, and not go crazy in the meantime. Are there any other, uh, things that you learned as you, uh, as you, um, did your production of your, uh, podcast that you would recommend?

[00:40:54] Tanner: Um, those starting out? Uh, As far as, as far as not losing your mind. Yeah. . Um, how, how, I know you talked about, um, using filters and, you know, like making sure like your setup is certain ways so that you just drop in your, uh, recording and anything along those lines. Well, okay. Sure. Let's, let's actually start with, um, those templates.

[00:41:22] Tanner: What, how are you editing your audio? Um, using GarageBand, but uh, this last one I used descript. Okay. How did you feel about the script experience? Uh, it was, it was tough first. Uh, I'd, I really blew it. Like I didn't, I stopped podcasting cuz it was such a horrible experience. But then yesterday I tried it and I took the time and it actually, like, I actually really liked it cuz I was paying attention to the details and, uh, sorry.

[00:41:54] Tanner: So I'm trying to do everything in, in there now, if that's possible. What's the, what's the, um, the theme of your show? Uh, it's, it's called Unleash Your Mindset. It's about, uh, over overcoming your inner challenges to reach your potential. Are you scripted? It sounds like you might be. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I, I, I interview guests, but you know, the intro and outro and, you know, those are all scripted.

[00:42:19] Tanner: Okay. Um, I kind of like the idea of using descript for a strictly interview show, um, because it are you by nature, a technically inclined person. Or is learning this stuff, the technical parts of this pretty card for you? Uh, the technical part of sound, uh, editing is difficult, but, uh, I am learning slowly.

[00:42:41] Tanner: Yeah. I, I think that first I don't, if you feel bad about using script, don't, if you feel like you're taking a cheat shortcut or something like that because it's not requiring to you to learn the engineering aspect. You are not, and maybe this is the first piece of advice. You're not an engineer. That's not what you do.

[00:42:58] Tanner: You're a coach of some kind, right? Mm-hmm. , you don't need to become an engineer. You, uh, need to create good coaching content for whoever is listening and then you can pay somebody else to become a good engineer. Yeah, right? You can do that. So, um, number one, don't beat yourself up about what you don't know and use tools that make the fact that you don't know certain things less impactful on the show.

[00:43:20] Tanner: So I'd stay with the script. That sounds like a great choice for you. Um, as far as not going crazy with the production schedule, how long is your show. ? Well, I, um, my current show is about an hour, hour, hour, 10 minutes, hour, 30 minutes conversations. But, uh, I want to go into the daily, you know, like you said, you know, like 10 minute episodes for motivation, inspiration, things like that.

[00:43:44] Tanner: So it'll be all, uh, scripted. So does that mean seven days a week or five days a week? I would say five days. And do you keep the one hour format for one episode and then the other four are 10 minutes? Uh, no thi this, uh, I'm thinking if maybe this is just like a offshoot of the podcast, uh, or maybe just, just to mix things up, offer this as well to, you know, so still not completely finalized with the details.

[00:44:13] Tanner: Um, I would say, uh, what's your subject matter? So you're coaching, uh, mindset and personal development. Mm-hmm. Oh, mindset. Right. Um, how long do you think it would take you, I imagine if they're 10 minute episodes, they become monologues. You're not interviewing people in 10 minutes. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, do are you a good writer?

[00:44:33] Tanner: I write, I like to write. Yeah. I would say, I would say that for you, the, the scripted approach to 10 minute episodes would be gorgeous. I mean, you'd be able to, you could probably bang out five, 10 minute scripts in a. Yeah. Uh, and I would take that approach because be careful with that because what, what happened to me, I don't know that it happens to everybody, but it definitely happened to me, was as soon as all your work's done on Monday at noon, you're like, fuck, I owe somebody something.

[00:44:59] Tanner: I've done something wrong. This has become too easy. I want to complicate my life. Um, so just be aware that you might feel guilty for that in, in the upfront, but I think that, you know, taking that, get everything done on Monday, especially for 10 minute episodes, and if you're really competent in the material, it's not gonna take you time to write that.

[00:45:17] Tanner: Right. And then your editing becomes, also because you're using script, if you can be con conscious of the fact of your breaths and your speed, and you can take a full break when you make a mistake to give it time so that it's a clean cut in script. Cuz script has a tendency to make kind of jagged edits.

[00:45:35] Tanner: So you hear part of a breath, but not the whole thing. And if you're reading a script, I mean, you're just gonna be able to do that better. And I think you'll find the descript will work even better for you. So, you know, scripts, script your stuff on Mondays or whatever day works for you. Take your time, don't beat yourself up.

[00:45:48] Tanner: Keep using Des. Okay, cool. Thanks. Put a lock on your door.

[00:45:57] Hector: Um, this is fantastic guys. We're rounding out here. Dave's got one more question, so, and then, uh, if anybody else has, uh, has any questions, throw 'em in there in the chat.

[00:46:06] Tanner: Uh, or raise your hand. I can uh, I can go, I can go long if, if that's beneficial.

[00:46:13] Hector: Oh, we appreciate that. Um, thanks man. Dave,

[00:46:16] Tanner: let's go to you.

[00:46:18] Tanner: Yeah, we'll just do this real quick. Uh, hi Tanner. Um, so my podcast is dumbing it down with Dave, you know, it's pragmatism, truth, happiness, and the search for it all. But pragmatism isn't the title. Dumbing it down with Dave is in the title. So, kind of like Tommy there, I'm 308 episodes in. But you really piqued my interest there with this Spotify thing there.

[00:46:38] Tanner: Uh, so let's, if we could do this real quick, cause I know we're getting, you know, close to the end of the, the whole deal here. Um, so Spotify is the only one with this search thing and what is it called? This, this thing, this search thing. So it, uh, it's a, I'm sure you've, everybody here has probably heard the word algorithm, but it's a little bit of a nebulous term.

[00:46:56] Tanner: Nobody really knows exactly what it is. It's essentially a bunch of rules of if this than that. A lot of math. Uh, and it's a, it's a, it's a robot trying to figure out what to do based on particular inputs. And I used to, uh, advise for a company called Pods and that was acquired by Spotify a year and a half ago.

[00:47:14] Tanner: And they are implementing this tech stack such that. Based on your listening habits, the suggestions you see for podcasts are, so it's a suggestion engine in the same way that you're used to on maybe any music listening stream that you use, um, is service that you use. So to give you an idea of just how well this works, um, can I do, can I do a screen share?

[00:47:35] Tanner: Am I allowed to do that?

[00:47:38] Hector: You are allowed. Let me, uh, adjust some settings here. Okay, go for it.

[00:47:44] Tanner: Gimme a second here. Um, so Tanner, lemme just interrupt real quick. My line of questioning is leading towards how do the rest of us here that have podcasts, you know, wherever my, I'm assuming we're all on Spotify.

[00:47:56] Tanner: Maybe not. I am, you know, how can we utilize this information you're about to share with us that you have shared with us that we can use hashtags or title changes or show notes in any way possible? You know, get more coverage, you know, whatever, this is the word on Spotify and possibly the 29 or 30 some odd other platforms based on our success that we might experience on Spotify based on what you're about to tell us.

[00:48:21] Tanner: Does that make sense? Uh, yeah. Here's the thing. Um, all those other platforms, when people say, you know, when you first start with a podcast , you distribute it to like 50 different, you know, it's not quite 50, but it's, uh, dozens of platforms. Mm-hmm. and, and I, I have been a firm, people do not like me for saying this, but I have been a firm believer that, that that is a waste of time, um, to be on these lesser platforms that make up less than a half of a half of a half of a percent of total listenership to put any kind of effort towards those other than you can submit to them.

[00:48:54] Tanner: But to put any effort towards them to care about them in any real capacity, uh, is. It's not, it's not a very valuable expenditure of anybody's time because most of your, uh, listeners sh sh here, let me do this screen share because I, I really want to drive this home. Um, yeah, I already have about 10 follow up to whatever you're about to say.

[00:49:17] Tanner: Yeah. Uh, hold on a second. And while you're doing that, I do expect most of those companies to go out of business in the next three to five years. I don't know why I do, but there's too many, there's too many platforms. There's too many, and they only do one thing and you can't do one thing anymore. Um, so, uh, I'm sorry that this is dragging.

[00:49:39] Tanner: I wasn't expecting to do this, but I wanted, I'll vamp for you, . Thanks. Um, what am I looking for? But I think it's true for anybody who doesn't know that I think this, this, like I'm on 30 platforms and I think I, you know, I get listens on 10 on my speaker, uh, statistics thing. Nobody's listening to me on. Um, It's 20 of 'em.

[00:50:00] Tanner: I don't know, there's just a waste of time. So I don't tweet them. I don't support them. I don't do anything with them. But I'm just kind of curious about what you're about to tell us or what you've told us. How that can help us with Spotify. And then maybe Spotify can help us with the other ones, cuz we're getting more popular on Spotify.

[00:50:14] Tanner: No hashtags, tweeting, Instagram, any of that stuff. Okay. So can you see this? Is this showing? Yeah. Yep. Okay. So this, let me get this for the month. Let me do this for just this month. The first to the 23rd. This is your show? This is my show, yeah. Um, so if we look at, uh, technology performances, the report that I care about, Spotify, 71%.

[00:50:44] Tanner: This is down from about 90% because the, the show's been around for. Um, the show's been around for a year, and I never marketed this show. When I started it, I started it in January on the fifth, last January, and I created an episode every Saturday. I woke up Saturday morning. I, I wrote a script after reading a meditation for Marcus Aurelius, and then I wrote a tr, uh, an explanation of what I thought that meant, edited, engineered, published once a week.

[00:51:12] Tanner: I didn't market it any, there's no Facebook account for it. There's no Twitter account for it, there's no social media anything for this. There's no effort. I did it for therapeutic reasons. This is when I talk about the X-factor, how serious this is by, I want to say May or something of that year. It had a hundred thousand downloads every month, and I thought, what the hell is happening?

[00:51:34] Tanner: So then I started to pay real attention to it. What I found was that the only place it was being listened to was Spotify. . Now that's, that's weird, right? Because I'm not doing any marketing and yet somehow Spotify is doing marketing for me. Something else that is, is worthy of note is that my demographic here for age, uh, is, you can see most of it is under, almost all of it really is under the age of 34.

[00:51:59] Tanner: It's a young demographic. My theory on this is that as as older podcast, and when I say older, I don't mean age old, I mean who have been podcasting for longer. As that generation ages out and new creators start to come in, new creators want tools. Tools that make marketing easier, which is what Spotify is trying to build.

[00:52:18] Tanner: They're trying to build something that makes marketing easier. If new creators are going to be on Spotify creating because the tools are easier, and young people already tend to use Spotify for listening to music, then it makes sense that at some point, like you said, all these pod catchers that make up, I mean like where was I?

[00:52:39] Tanner: I mean, Applecore Media and Apple Podcasts are the same thing, essentially. I mean, just Applecore Media means an app that runs on Apple that doesn't have its user agent set. So we can't tell what it is, but it's happening on Apple, 1% on Chrome, 1% on Google Podcast pockets, overcast 1%. Why would I make any effort to try to reach these people?

[00:52:58] Tanner: Not that they don't matter, just like imagine the amount of money I'm gonna have to spend to target that and the effort just for a 1% return. So I think the future is a, is a hundred percent Spotify. And I think the reason for that is because podcasters don't know how to market. They don't know how to build brands.

[00:53:14] Tanner: It's like, it's not their thing. They're, they're content creators. They know their thing. Um, so I'm really heavy into SP Spotify just. You don't have to do anything to take advantage of Spotify. Your titling can suck in Spotify. Everything can suck in Spotify so long as . He's happy about that. So long as, uh, like your, your titling should be relevant because I, I shouldn't say that.

[00:53:38] Tanner: It doesn't matter. Your titling for your episodes should be relevant. Your, uh, show notes should be on point. They should be providing context to the algorithms on Spotify. And Spotify is gonna go out and it's gonna find people who wanna listen to that. It's gonna do work for you and it's not gonna charge you for it.

[00:53:53] Tanner: Now, they do have an advertising platform, but it kind of sucks. So they're out, their algorithms actually better than their advertising platform. Uh, so as far as what you need to do, I, I think you need to accept the possible reality that the only two games that matter in town are Apple and Spotify. And if you want to do anything on Apple, you have gotta care about your seo.

[00:54:16] Tanner: In inside of your, inside of your, uh, episode titles and your show notes and your, uh, show titles because that is how they are indexing and it's how people are searching. And if you lean a hundred percent into Spotify, you really don't have to worry about any of that because they're gonna try to match good content with the listeners who are looking for it.

[00:54:34] Tanner: Now, caveat, if you are, uh, if you're a podcast about, uh, like early retirement or something, and your demographic is 55 year olds or 50 year olds, Spotify's not ready for you yet, and it probably won't be for another 10 years. But if your demographic is, is people under let's say 40, it probably makes sense for you to only be focusing on Spotify because Spotify's doing that marketing and um, exposure work for you.

[00:55:03] Tanner: They're doing that discovery work for you and they're putting less on your plate. Oh, I can stop sharing this. Sorry, I'm not, so, Tyler, this is, this is, uh, will you just show this? This is the last three edges, 65 days. No, this is the, no, this is the last 30 days. Last 30 days, yeah. And what was it you were showing this?

[00:55:19] Tanner: That's from Spotify? Yeah. So 192,965 downloads come from Spotify. That's 71%. And 17, 18, 90, 20, 22 and 22% come from Apple in one form or another. And the rest of it is disseminated across, I dunno, probably two dozen lesser apps that, you know, only people who are like, I care about my privacy, I'm gonna use a special app.

[00:55:40] Tanner: If you care about your privacy, great. But , that's cool. On the top up, it said boom caster. Is that, was that a spot, is is all information from Spotify? Is that what No, all that information, sorry. I'll, I'll do this again just to make sure that it's okay. Where, where can we see that for us? Because I only have Spreaker, so mine doesn't look like yours.

[00:55:59] Tanner: And mine's not as detailed as yours. Is that a third party? No. So, uh, Spotify owns a company called Megaphone. They bottom. Two years ago, three years ago. Uh, megaphone is a hosting provider. A hosting provider is the, you know, like a Lipsen or like a blueberry, or like a transistor. It's the hosting where you upload your audio for you.

[00:56:16] Tanner: It's speaker. They have those stats. Uh, if they don't, that I, if I find it hard to believe that speaker doesn't have those stats, they probably gotta

[00:56:24] Hector: check it on, on website. I gotta pay for the

[00:56:27] Tanner: premium packages. I have some stats that I have to pay. Um, and then, and then Boom. Caster is an alternative to like squad cast and Riverside.

[00:56:35] Tanner: It's, it's the thing. I used to conduct interviews. It was just a shortcut in my, uh, in my toolbar. Right. You host on Megaphone your show, your host is hosted on Megaphone. Yes, correct. I used to be hosted, uh, elsewhere, but uh, glass Box requires that on Megaphone, so that's what I did. That helps. All right.

[00:56:52] Tanner: That makes some sense. I mean, you know, so, so sort of your advice to us, other than titles, Working on the show notes, making sure it's appropriate to the title of the show and the subject of the show and what people are searching for. Right. These are all helpful things. We're making all these connections.

[00:57:07] Tanner: Right. Thank you Dave. Yeah. And if we tweak, we should be seeing a little bit more towards Spotify maybe? Uh, I think so, but please keep in mind that demographic difference. I mean, like, I have almost no 50 year old listeners. All the 50 year listeners are on Apple. We're somewhere else. So if you appeal to a young audience, Spotify is, is the future really.

[00:57:29] Hector: Alright, we are dipping over the hour here, but I want to get in, um, one last question here to Brian. Um, I'll go to you, my man.

[00:57:35] Tanner: Sorry. Actually have two, hopefully they, they won't take long one. I'm curious in your thought on, uh, camera angle. Um, we have, uh, this one, well, I mean we have a, um, a conversational podcast.

[00:57:49] Tanner: We're, we're new. We're, we're still only 20 episodes in and we're trying to find kind of our footing. On. It feels like everybody you talked to, you know, today we recorded two episodes. Both were experienced podcasters and they both had very different camera angles. So I, I'd love your perspective on that.

[00:58:05] Tanner: And then, and then second, uh, I may be a little bit different than some on this. Um, in this group we, we have a, a, a company, uh, that is the primary source of our revenue, and the podcast is a marketing channel that hangs off of it. I, I'd love your, your thoughts on, uh, naming conventions in regards to the, the company, um, and the podcast being the same or different and how you think about.

[00:58:32] Tanner: Uh, does the podcast itself need its own social channels? I think you know where I'm going with that. Yeah. Thank you. Um, sure. I'll start with the camera angle cuz it's the thing I know the least about. Clearly. Uh, I don't run a video podcast. Um, I actually never have run a video podcast. I just launched a YouTube channel not two weeks ago, uh, for practical philosophy.

[00:58:53] Tanner: And I'm, I'm learning a lot about lighting and camera angles and blah, blah, blah, but I have recently learned that you can use your iPhone on your Mac as a webcam. That's been super helpful cuz I have a. Stand here on my desktop to get a more flattering angle of myself. Um, but you know, I'm kind of old school in that regard and I'm uneducated in, in video production.

[00:59:13] Tanner: So I think that, you know, fa head on. So you're, I'm actually looking at you, not looking at you, the person I'm talking to, but looking at you, the audience. So I like, um, there's a live platform called Streamy Yard that we use for our live events. And you're sh you're nodding your head because you've used it.

[00:59:32] Tanner: Uh, I've, I've been a part of a streamy yard. We haven't used it yet. Uh, I, I like how that works and I like the ability for you to stay center camera on that. And you can also design it and make it prettier and have lower thirds and, you know, it's a little pricey at 50 to a hundred dollars a month, depending on the number of hours you need to livestream.

[00:59:50] Tanner: But, um, I, I love that solution and I don't think I should say more on video cause that's really not my expertise and I don't wanna fake it. . That's all right. No, I appreciate it. Um, as far as. Business podcasting. Business. Podcasting is actually was the bread and butter of my studio in Maine for a long time.

[01:00:05] Tanner: Um, and my position has always been that you do kind of a Venn diagram of, uh, the, the product that is provided and the community to whom it is provided and, and over it, where it overlaps. There's a, there's a shared interest. So for example, we did some work with. Uh, with, with LL Bean who wanted to create a podcast for, um, for their brand.

[01:00:29] Tanner: And they said, well, should, you know, should it be about LL Bean? And I'm, I'm like, no. Of course not. Nobody wants to listen to, I mean, I love LL Bee. I'm from Maine, but, uh, nobody wants to listen to a podcast about ll uh, LL Bean. So I said, you know, what you really ought to be doing is what, who are all your customers?

[01:00:45] Tanner: What do they do? Well, they, they like the outdoors. Okay, great. You need to meet them where they are in that community and provide them with value as the sponsor of the show. But the show has nothing to do with l b, and it has everything to do with adventure. You're talking to people who have climbed Mount Est, you're talking to people who have good camping tips, you know, whatever's relevant.

[01:01:06] Tanner: So you're creating content for your community, but you are not in it. For example, the, the way that they would introduce it is, I'm gonna screw it up, but it, it was something like, I can't remember what the name of the show was. It wasn't even, um, The, the outdoor experience or something. Welcome to the LL Bean Studios, or recorded at the LL Bean Studios.

[01:01:28] Tanner: So the brand is in front of the listener, but not in an obtuse way, and not in a way that's interruptive or makes it clear that the entire thing is a commercial, even though the entire thing is a commercial . Um, so, so creating content is this genuinely for that community in such a way that they fall in love with the content and appreciate you for making it.

[01:01:46] Tanner: And then when they think, oh, you know, I'm gonna buy something, they've been listening to your podcast for a year, and they're gonna buy it from you because of how, how you've served them. So I hope that answers the question. Yeah, yeah. One last follow up to it. It makes a ton of sense. Should our podcast have its own social presence By, by name?

[01:02:04] Tanner: Right. Because right now, I mean, our audience is, is relatively small. We're, um, m and A advisory. And on the podcast we talk to founders who have sold their business and tell their stories, their successes and failures. We've, we've presented, um, most of the content to this point via our primary brand. Do we need to create social media handles for the podcast?

[01:02:32] Tanner: Uh, it feels a bit in our size a bit unnecessary. I'm, I'm, I'm totally gonna be the wrong guy to answer this. Um, I don't know if Hector has told you this, but I am notoriously all about spending money on paid advertising and paid social than I am about social strategies with like daily posts and Twitter.

[01:02:49] Tanner: Like that is not my brain. Can I handle that? Um, however, have you had Ariel on here? Hector? He will

[01:02:55] Hector: be here in two weeks.

[01:02:56] Tanner: Should Ariel is, Ariel is the person you need to ask that question to. She is a fucking wizard. Um, and if anybody can answer it ass her, it's not me. Uh, my inclination is no. But run that by her before you make a decision.

[01:03:09] Tanner: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, I, I appreciate it. Thank you very much. Sure.

[01:03:16] Tanner: Sweet.

[01:03:16] Hector: Yeah, she's gonna be here. Um, in, in two weeks. Next week we have, uh, Christina Marchello from Pod Chaser, and then, uh, we have Ariel from, she's, she's just got, she just joined the Podcast Academy as a board member and she's squad cast. And

[01:03:31] Tanner: ask, uh, ask Christina when she gets here, you guys make sure to ask her about, uh, uh, what did you just say to pod chasers?

[01:03:39] Tanner: Um, they're, they're paid their premium product because the data they can give you is like sick. If you can afford to spend money on getting data about your listeners, you wanna give pod chaser your money . So they, they've got really good data.

[01:03:52] Hector: Guys, I want to, um, If we can unmute yourself and just give a, a collective thank you or praise or, you know, whatever we, whatever we wanna give to Tanner.

[01:04:03] Hector: This is totally out of the love and, and kindness of his heart. I sent him a message at like midnight one night, or I don't know, it was, it was in the mi in the dono night and, uh, whatever that is. And, uh, he came through cuz he just has a, a heart of gold and I, I appreciate that, man. Um, and all you've done for, for podcasting and like I said at the beginning, the, the example, um, and maybe, uh, I know, I know it's a lot of pressure, but the precedent that you've set, um, for, for indie podcasters, you know, to go out there and make it.

[01:04:28] Hector: So, um, I wanted to, to to honor you

[01:04:31] Tanner: for that. If you ever, if you ever need somebody to not give you bullshit, uh, just reach out and is the guy, man, no nonsense. He will tell you if you're

[01:04:41] Hector: good day. The, uh, can you give us really quickly, um, the show. . And then I know you're, uh, um, kind of around on social. So if there's any places where people could stay connected, um, if they wanted

[01:04:56] Tanner: to.

[01:04:56] Tanner: Oh man. I've gotta tell you, like one of the most beautiful things about going full-time philosophy is that I don't have to be on social anymore, period. , like I killed my Twitter. I had like 10,000 followers on Twitter. I killed it. I just shut it off. I deleted my Facebook account. I I was totally pulled the plug.

[01:05:11] Tanner: Um, but you can find me at uh, tanner campbell.net cuz some son of a gun got the.com. Uh, and you can always email me, tanner no sages.com. So that, that's the company's website. And the podcast is Practical stoicism. If you have even a passing interest in learning about stoicism with a capital S and not the dude bro version, uh, that lives in Silicon Valley and tells you that you should have no feelings and men don't cry and all that nonsense, if you wanna learn the right socialism, the real one, uh, please stop by and listen to it.

[01:05:41] Tanner: I'd appreciate it. And

[01:05:43] Hector: some really sick cover art too that he

[01:05:45] Tanner: just dropped. Uh oh, thanks, man. We actually had somebody from the Discord community reach out an offer to do that to us, for us. He didn't even charge me for it. And, uh, that was very, very kind of him. And thank you for saying that. I think it's a super dope, uh,

[01:05:56] Hector: artwork.

[01:05:57] Hector: Yeah, and I think it really, it speaks to that younger demographic that you're kind of pulling into.

[01:06:02] Tanner: No, no. Your market man. No. Your market. Yeah.

[01:06:04] Hector: Absolutely. All right guys, we are going to kill the recording here. Um, of course, you guys wanna stick around and, and ask anything. Um, you can definitely do that.

[01:06:10] Hector: And, uh, I guess quick, quick note on Thursday we have, um, one last, uh, or we have our discussion and your, your to-dos this week are to get your next episode or your first episode recorded and edited as well. So bring some questions back to the discussion on Thursday.