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[00:00:02] Hector: Hello and welcome to another episode of podcasting success secrets. My name is Hector Santia Esteban and I'm your host for today. I'm merely the guide, the facilitator. Our guest of honor today is Mr. Paul Levitin. Did I get that right?

[00:00:15] Paul: Correct.

[00:00:16] Hector: Yes, big on last names because someone yesterday told me that she was like, you've got a really long last name.

[00:00:20] Hector: And I was like, thank you. I know I wasn't aware. didn't find that over the first 32 years of my life. Paul is host. Of the happy, healthy human show and approaching 300 episodes. welcome to our podcasting success secrets, Paul. Thanks for being here today.

[00:00:41] Paul: thank you very much for having me. And I appreciate that being here means I'm officially a podcast success story. So it means a lot.

[00:00:49] Hector: you are for sure. you're definitely part of our podcasting success series, which we've been doing because. I think that there's so much to gain from everyone's journey and whether you've got, health and personal development and inspirational kind of show like yourself whether you have any type of show that the listener might be having.

[00:01:08] Hector: something to gain from your experience and you're almost 300 episodes in. I know that that was a journey in of itself and I'm excited to get into it. the show is happy, healthy human. that's a great name, which is awesome. maybe we start there, but take us back to the beginnings of the show.

[00:01:24] Hector: what's hero or the super villain origin story, if you will? For the podcast.

[00:01:29] Paul: Yeah, for sure. So happy, healthy human just about sums it up, right? when people ask, what's your show about? And I'm just like,that's the name You can hopefully guess from the name, right? it's everything that's going to help you beat that. It started because I was a personal trainer and nutrition coach and a board look licensed health and wellness coach.

[00:01:45] Paul: I still technically am all of those things, but I don't actively work in that field anymore. But COVID happened. And I was living in New York city at the time, working in a gym where I was coaching, full time COVID came, shut down all the gyms. And even prior to that, I had done some online coaching, that kind of stuff.

[00:02:02] Paul: And I just realized. Throughout my career as a coach, I'd been doing it for 10 years. There's certain conversations that I have all the time. anyone who does their job realizes you know what you do and most of your job is explaining that to other people. Or, when you have, if you're a salesperson, you have the same sales pitch that you give everyone.

[00:02:18] Paul: So as a trainer, as a coach, there's certain things that I'm just like, every single person I work with, I have to give them the same spiel. So then I just started to record those things. because I figured that one, it's easier for me because now instead of having to have that conversation with people, I just go, Okay, this is what you're struggling with.

[00:02:34] Paul: Here's an episode that I did on that. And it's also a way to help more people. Before I was a podcaster, I enjoyed listening to podcasts. So it's a medium that I enjoy. so that's how it started. the very first episode is start with why, right?

[00:02:44] Paul: find your why, because when I get a new client, that's probably the first conversation that we have. The second episode is Building habits because that's the same thing. That's a conversation that I have to have, all these different things that I would do with people all the time. I just started to record them and then it grew from there and became something a little bit more involved.

[00:03:01] Paul: But yeah, that's how it started.

[00:03:03] Hector: at least seem like someone who just jumps right in and is figuring things out and then looks up and it's Oh shoot, I'm already, three or four steps into this. was that kind of how that played out? Or was there a one part of the hero's journey, that was popularized by Joseph Campbell is this refusal to the call, right?

[00:03:20] Hector: Some kind of turning away of it did you just jump in or was there some dragging of the feet, if you will?

[00:03:26] Paul: you're definitely right. It was 100 percent just jumping in the dragging of the feet would have been in, I think doing it better because I am a big. Proponent of done is better than perfect and perfectionism is something I talk about a lot of my show. It's the number one thing that's going to hold people back.

[00:03:41] Paul: So knowing that and knowing myself, I know that if I tried to get it to I wouldn't do it at all. So there was a level of I'm just going to do it. So you and I were talking before we started recording because I got a new mic. This is the first time I bought a new mic since I started podcasting.

[00:03:55] Paul: The mic that I've been using up until today literally has been the 20 mic I got on Amazon when I googled podcast mic and bought the first cheapest one I could and that was it. I still record on GarageBand and have my stuff hosted on Anchor because when I looked up podcasting stuff that was free and easy and I started and I just never stopped.

[00:04:14] Paul: there's a level of I just wanted to rip the bandaid off and do it. now I'm trying to optimize more right there's a I think a time for just doing and then there's a time for optimization. again, this is not with podcasting.

[00:04:24] Paul: This is life. But if you try to optimize, you can optimize yourself out of doing the thing. And that's when I'm like, okay, like maybe it's not the time to getting everything done the right way. It's just take action. So that's where I was. That's how I started. now I've shifted gears and that's my current struggle is okay, like how do I make this better now that it's a thing and I'm doing it, how do I get it right?

[00:04:43] Paul: But when I started, it was just like, I'm going to do it every. Week or twice a week, whatever cadence was that I committed to is no matter what I'm going to put out an episode, even if I have nothing figured out, there's an episode back that I can, I don't remember what number it is, but like where I was literally, I committed to releasing episodes at 6am every Tuesday didn't have an episode recorded, so it's 5am and you can hear me like still with like sleep in my voice.

[00:05:06] Paul: yeah. and I wake up during the episode cause I was just like, I'm just going to do this thing. And Get it done. So that's definitely the type of person I am to just go and figure it out as I'm going.

[00:05:15] Hector: Yeah. and one of the reasons that I wanted to acknowledge that you are a success is that. you're still going, you've continued on and also because everybody gets to create their own metric, right? if they're still continuing on and it still seems like after doing it for 270 episodes times, however many hours takes for you to actually get something out from, the time of inception through editing through all of it, if it still seems like something worth doing, then That is a success because we haven't seen the totality of it either. I do want to acknowledge you for that and anybody else who's in that position, you talked about like now you're starting to uplevel things, were there other evolutions, if you will, of the show?

[00:05:54] Hector: when you look back, from episode zero to 50 or, 50 to a hundred, like, were there other. stages, maybe micro evolutions that you went through, as you were continuing to publish episodes.

[00:06:05] Paul: for sure. in the beginning it was a lot, it was literally just me talking and freestyling, just have an idea and mumbling my way through it, which I can do. I have confidence in my speaking abilities and I go on other people's shows where there's no script or anything like that.

[00:06:19] Paul: But eventually I did start my solo. So I do solo episodes and guest episodes. I alternate. And when listening back to my solo episodes, I realized that I will get to the point, but would eventually start like going in circles I didn't like it. It wasn't succinct enough. So I started to write my episodes ahead of time and give myself a script to work off of.

[00:06:39] Paul: I've also tried shorter time lengths, formats, different releasing. Cadences. So the reason I have so many episodes, even for a time, I was releasing once a week, then I was releasing twice a week. And then I went to five or six times a week with smaller mini episodes. So I would do a longer guest episode, a longer solo episode, and then smaller five to 10 minute, like mini sodes just to see what works.

[00:07:01] Paul: I personally like the longer episode style, because again, that's what I listen to if I look at someone's podcast page and they have an episode, that's seven minutes. I usually listen to it. it's less than 30 minutes, I probably won't listen to it because I know that they probably have ads in there.

[00:07:16] Paul: And then if it's a seven minute show with ads. I'm getting four minutes of content or something like that. And it just doesn't seem worth it to me. what's what are you actually going to tell me in that? I also listened to my podcast on two or three X speed. So then it's I'm literally listening to it for one minute and it just, doesn't make sense to me.

[00:07:30] Paul: I like the long in depth conversations, but I wanted to try and see what worked for other people. Cause it's not just about me. It's about the listener as well. So I've. Try different things. I've done longer. I've done shorter. I've done more episodes a week. I've done less episodes a week. I've done different styles of interviewing.

[00:07:45] Paul: I've done different styles of my own show. So it's all just trial and error then and what I like and what works and figuring it out as I go.

[00:07:52] Hector: Yeah, I'm glad that you are reiterating something that we've talked about on this show, which is that by changing up and varying your episode lengths, that you actually attract a different sort of listener, and I've always intuited that, and I've seen that in our, some of our shows, and you just echoing that point, I think it's a great lesson for podcasters and also because I think that there's somehow some, podcast guru or something is saying that all of your episodes have to be exactly the same length every time and otherwise you're not going to be successful. And I just don't know if that's out there and you're hearing that.

[00:08:28] Hector: I just want to say that's nonsense and tomfoolery as a. My elementary school teachers used to say, you said that you found things that work for you, how much of it was what works for you and what you are seeing from the audience or is that something that you've thought about?

[00:08:44] Paul: So that's,when I talk about places where I could improve, that's definitely one of them, right? paying attention to metrics and, more feedback from the audience. It's one of those things where It's not that I only want to hear good things, but in the reality, it's the opposite of a Google review, right?

[00:09:01] Paul: It's like when you go on Yelp, and all you see is shitty reviews. because those are the people who take the time to write reviews. Whereas with podcasts, I feel like it's the opposite when people don't. Shout me out on Instagram or tag me or something like that because it was a great episode.

[00:09:13] Paul: It's awesome to hear. I love that, but I probably don't hear from the people who are like, no, I didn't really like that. They're not taking the time to upload a story on Instagram to go. This episode was all right, but it was lacking X, Y, and Z, So it's hard to get that feedback.

[00:09:27] Paul: when I'm saying what works for me, it's really more about what I can keep up with because To me, we all hear about whatever they want to call it, pod fade or whatever. And it's like pod, the podcast graveyard. And it's and again, this goes back to what I teach about just life and health in general.

[00:09:40] Paul: consistency is the name of the game, right? It's like through the simple virtue of releasing nearly 300 episodes over the course of three years, not because I know what I'm doing, not because I do anything particularly well, but. Simply through not stopping. Have I become a quote unquote success story, right?

[00:09:55] Paul: So that's my main thing is like allowing myself to exist in an environment where I can keep that up. And then knowing that just through again, the sheer virtue of trial and error and practice and what you learn as you go, I will continue to get better. So it's not really okay, like I'm iterating in the sense that don't know if X, Y, and Z works in that sense.

[00:10:14] Paul: It's more of a, just I know what's working for me through the feedback, whatever feedback I do get, I can take that into account. And then just what's going to allow me to put out a show that I enjoy putting out, because I think that's the most important thing. Because I can have all metrics in the world that says something is working.

[00:10:30] Paul: And if I don't want to do it, it doesn't really matter.

[00:10:33] Hector: exactly. people always ask me like, what's the right thing or what's the right way to do. Blank. there's a way that's going to work for you. And that's what we should work towards and identify. how much is the podcast a part of your business or how much of it is a business or like, how do you think about the show in regards to getting a return or it, being something that is.

[00:10:56] Hector: Profitable or gets an ROI in whatever sense that might mean to you. Is that something that, that you're thinking about at all?

[00:11:02] Paul: right now, no, but in the past, yes. And in general, yes. So right now, as I said before, I was a coach for a long time and I had my own coaching business. Which I shuttered for the last year, as I transitioned to do doing some other things in my professional life. And so in that time, I wasn't really using it as a part of a business, but for the first two years, it was a top of funnel lead generator.

[00:11:27] Paul: And it was for me, the best thing that I could do for business because I would talk to someone on Facebook or Instagram or in person or wherever you meet someone and about the things that I like to talk about and their struggles and their life and their weight and their health and their mindset and their success, all the things that I talk about and I'd go, okay, as I said, okay, you're struggling with imposter syndrome.

[00:11:48] Paul: Okay, cool. Here's an episode. I did on that. Oh, you're struggling with consistency with your habits. Okay, cool. Here's an episode I did on that. And then people would come back to me saying Oh, you gave me that episode. And I listened to it. And I also listened to seven more. And that's what they call a warm lead.

[00:12:03] Paul: That's someone who's going to then When I have a product that's ready to launch or when I have coaching that I am doing, I'm going to be able to go back to them and be like, Hey, you like what I gave you for free? And that's what you get when just for nothing. here's what I'm selling and why it can be beneficial to you.

[00:12:17] Paul: So all of the high, I was doing high ticket coaching. Almost all of my clients came through the which is why now, even though I don't offer that as much, it's not my main thing. What I still look at. Yeah. Podcasting as a business in the sense that it's the ultimate top of funnel.

[00:12:31] Paul: gets people into my ecosystem and people who are in my ecosystem, people who listen to what I have to say and are on the train with me. Those are people that if, and when I have something to sell, know how to do that. So for me, it's all about just growing that, growing my audience.

[00:12:47] Paul: And I think it's easy to turn on that spigot, that faucet. When you need to, as they say, building loyalty, people want to know how much you care, people buy from who they know, like, and trust all these little marketing sayings. It's that's what I'm building with the podcast.

[00:13:01] Paul: So even if I'm not selling anything currently, It's always an option and having that, library of information builds, respectability and credibility. So if someone comes to me and they see my Instagram and they click on my podcast and they see that I have hundreds of episodes and all these things with all these different guests.

[00:13:17] Paul: That is credibility and there's something to be said for that. So it all to me, again, exists together, even if I'm not selling right now, it's still a big part of what is a business.

[00:13:25] Hector: Yeah, that's a great point that didn't even really need to listen to the episodes for them to get that sort of credibility that comes with having an archive And even better if they obviously go out, go through and listen to them, however you look forward, whether think about it for this next year or.

[00:13:42] Hector: The next however many years. What do you think the evolution, like how do you see your, you wanting to evolve with both how the podcasting space and industry as a whole is moving, but just technology in general. AI being a component of it.

[00:13:57] Hector: how do you see yourself or, and your show continuing to adapt and evolve with. It's the changing landscape that's out there.

[00:14:04] Paul: it's hard.like you said, AI and technology and competition is only growing and podcasting. Everyone has a podcast and it's so quote unquote overcrowded. And yet at the same time, there's 5 million podcasts and, it only takes, thousand true fans or something like that.

[00:14:21] Paul: And in reality, it doesn't matter how many other people are saying the exact same thing as you. It's about saying it in your voice. And so my goal is to just grow like that. My goal for the podcast, my goal with my life, with my business is to just be a I can coach, I can sell courses, I can sell one on one coaching and I've done that stuff in the past and I know how to do that.

[00:14:42] Paul: But my dream, my goal is to just have a podcast that's successful that I can just focus on that full time and interview people and have conversations that affect people's lives. Because I know for a fact that whether it's my solo episodes or the conversations that I have with people.

[00:14:58] Paul: It helps people in some way, people, enough people, again, as for whatever, like I said, I only get the positive feedback, but the positive feedback is positive. people tell me all the time, Oh, I listened to this episode. And, I cried. I listened to this episode and I listened to it three more times.

[00:15:10] Paul: And I took notes. I listened to this episode. And then I went back to episode one and listened to every episode from the beginning, like crazy shit like that, which is wow, that's wild. It's something that like, I believe In myself, I believe in the content, I believe in the knowledge that I'm spreading.

[00:15:24] Paul: I don't really care what everyone else is doing. I think there's room out there for everyone. I think that everyone who has something to say should be able to say it. And my goal is to just create a platform for myself where just spreading information, spreading knowledge, spreading whatever you want to call it, is able to sustain me and continue to grow and reach more people and affect more lives.

[00:15:44] Hector: it's a beautiful thing. There's this debate that's happening right now on Twitter with a former guest of the show, Rob Greenlee and the so called inventor of podcasting, Adam Curry, and it's a joking debate, but both of them feel very strongly about. How they feel.

[00:16:03] Hector: And on one side, Adam Curry is digging in his heels and saying that podcasts are, RSS feeds and audio only and this very traditional idea of what a podcast is. And Rob is podcasting is more than that today. It's evolved at least In the culture and in the general minds of the, of mass consumers that podcasts doesn't necessarily need to be audio only that maybe there's a video component, like maybe it's not on an RSS feed made evolved. and I think that it's beautiful that there's still that opportunity for people to hop in and spread a message they're passionate about,

[00:16:41] Paul: it would be silly to think that something like this wouldn't evolve, when podcasting first came out, even though it was only 15 years ago or whatever, 15 years ago, it was a long time in technology. And now TikTok is a thing and YouTube is a thing and all of these other things that didn't exist.

[00:16:55] Paul: So it's I guess if you want to be technical, it's is it a podcast if it's on YouTube? And I get the argument, but in reality it's, going to take the shape of, how many people don't even still know what a podcast is, but they do on Instagram and tick tock, watch the clips and the reels of like podcasts, not even realizing what it is, but getting one to two minute snippets of someone's podcast where they're just like, that's all they ever do.

[00:17:16] Paul: They follow that person's tick tock and they see all of their content in that way, but they're never going to go to Spotify or the podcast page and listen to an actual podcast. So it's meeting people where they're at and you just being, Open to allowing them to figure out how they want to, take it in.

[00:17:31] Hector: Last question here, Paul, before we wrap this up, and you may have reiterated a little bit, but, or you may have mentioned a little bit, in your opinion, what do you feel is the secret to your podcasting success?

[00:17:43] Paul: just to be, frank, it's hard for me to consider it a success, even though I understand by what, by some metrics it is by my own personal metrics, I still have a really long way to go, but I appreciate the question. I think it's two things. one is just consistency, to win when you don't give up. everything in life. You just for the sheer virtue of just not saying oh, screw this or getting bored or getting tired or moving on to the next shiny object. That's clearly what's made me a quote unquote success in this regard.

[00:18:09] Paul: And then also I do. Believe in and stand on the content and the quality. I believe that the reason I've been able to get this far again, without knowing anything about mics or not knowing anything about editing or not knowing anything about shit is because regardless of everything else, people can listen and there's quality in the content.

[00:18:26] Paul: So I think it's both. I think that you need the quality. But quality in the short term won't give you anything need the consistency, but being longterm shit won't get you anything either. So it's having both, it's, two sides of the same coin. you can't have one without the other, but when you have both, that's when you hit that secret sauce.

[00:18:43] Hector: brilliant stuff. Paul, we'd love for you to share where and how people can best find the show and how they might be able to get better connected with you.

[00:18:50] Paul: love that. it's happy, healthy human on all podcast platforms. I hope that I'm there. Apple, Spotify, wherever else, not really YouTube. I do have a few episodes, but not my whole library is not on YouTube yet. That's something that is again, coming with growth and then social media. It's just my name on all platforms at Paul Levitin across Instagram, Tick Tock, Facebook, Twitter.

[00:19:10] Paul: I have lots of free stuff. If you want anything, if you're interested in habit building and the science of habit building, I have free guides, free checklists, shoot me a message on Instagram or Facebook, and I'll happily send you anything in this regard that seems helpful.

[00:19:22] Hector: And we'll, link up all of those into the show notes as well. I want to thank all of you for being here and being part of the pod fam. we appreciate you, you sticking with us today, wherever you get your podcast, we'd be forever grateful for a rating or review, especially if you're on Spotify, if you have that Spotify app on your phone.

[00:19:39] Hector: They have some stars at the top of the show. You could hop over and give as many as you think that we are worth. and we'd pray and you can honor my need for validation with, all the stars that you can give. if you know a podcaster or someone who's thinking about starting a show, send them this episode.

[00:19:54] Hector: hit that little share button and text them or email them or message them or. Send them a bat signal. However, you might let them know because I think that this is a great lesson in just doing it right. figuring it out along the way and taking action and seeing the results. you can see the results, So anyways, we appreciate y'all being here. We'll see on the next one. There you go.